Vote Against Health Care Bill
By The IntelligencerLess than a week after proposing a new 2,074-page health care bill, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid reportedly wants a vote on it today, or at least within the next few days. Clearly, such a vote would be a test of Democratic Party discipline, not a referendum on the bill itself. Reid, D-Nev., has not permitted senators even time to read and discuss the measure.
The fact that no one really knows what the bill, if enacted, would do was made apparent Friday. On Wednesday, Reid and other liberal senators said the bill would cost $849 billion over a 10-year period. By Friday, they were revealing that, well, a slight error had been made. In reality the bill would cost $979 billion, Senate leaders admitted.
A $130 billion, or more than 15 percent, increase in cost estimates is a startling change. What else do senators and the American people have yet to learn about the measure?
But Reid and his liberal cronies don't want to allow anyone to delve too deeply into the proposal. That has become the primary strategy of President Barack Obama and liberals in Congress: Insist that a crisis requiring immediate, drastic action exists. Then ram expensive measures intended to expand the cost and power of government past lawmakers.
What little is known about the Senate bill is troubling. In some respects it appears to be a carbon copy of a bill already approved by a narrow margin in the House of Representatives. That measure would slash spending for the Medicare program, would increase the cost and limit choices in health care for many Americans.
In some respects the Senate bill is different. A House measure intended to prevent expenditure of public money to fund abortions has been weakened dramatically in the Senate bill.
So eager is Reid to pass the bill that he has resorted to what amounts to bribery. It has been reported that one Democratic senator, Mary Landrieu, of Louisiana, has reservations about the plan. On Thursday it was reported by The Associated Press that Reid inserted $100 million in spending for health care in Landrieu's state, as "a political sweetener" for her.
Of the four senators who represent our states, two - Sens. Jay Rockefeller, D-W.Va., and Sherrod Brown, D-Ohio - have said they plan to vote in favor of the bill. Sen. George Voinovich, R-Ohio, has said he will vote against it.
To his credit, Sen. Robert Byrd, D-W.Va., has not made up his mind on the bill. His staff told our reporter that he wanted to obtain more information about it before making a decision.
We urge Byrd to vote against the measure. We urge Rockefeller and Brown to change their stances and do likewise.
From what we know about the proposal, it is not in the best interests of most Americans. It amounts to one of the most dramatic expansions of government power in history. The overwhelming majority of people it would affect have no idea of what is contained in the bill. We doubt that a majority of senators truly understand it. How could they, given uncertainties such as the $130 billion change in cost estimates?
The bill does not address some of the root causes of high health care costs for most people. In fact, again, it would increase health care costs for many Americans.
Senators should do the right thing for their constituents - and reject the bill.
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Graysongs
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11-22-09 10:23 PM
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Reactionary - Yep, the whiny butt 'church lady' and all around 'do gooder' wonderwhy is a thing to behold, ain't she? I'm glad she comes around and shows her empty-headedness, though, because it's fun to "bully" her and poke her with a stick. Now, old "tinkerbell" - that one's a hoot, too. Give him 1 or 2 posts before he starts calling you names.
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Reactionary
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11-22-09 9:02 PM
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wonder---as per your 12:59 post-- I could care less what you think of Bush, or any other Republican, alive or dead! Your opinion is just not that important to me. I just get a kick out of seeing you constantly whine about everything and everybody, ALL THE TIME! When are YOU up for Saint-hood? Being so knowledgable and proper and caring and RIGHT----ALL THE TIME? I'd like to attend the ceremony. AS I would also like to be there for YOUR Nobel Prize for "Googlizing"! zippie,..............you putz. If you truely believe that YOUR taxes will not be raised because of BarryHusseinCare2009, you are truely a bigger fool than I thought.
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Reactionary
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11-22-09 8:53 PM
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I started to read these posts then just gave up. Almost all of the libbie posts deal with whining about the "Rich Man", and those mean old nasty insurance companies. Sound like green eyed envy to me! Some here claim to want to debate"facts" when in reality all they want to do is whine, complain and blowbag about how they deserve better than what they have, but that they want someone else to pay for it. Same old B/S. Personally, I hope they get everything they deserve, and all at once!
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Graysongs
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11-22-09 8:36 PM
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former - Nah, most Chihauhas type in Spanish. Wonder types in English - well, almost. And every neighborhood should have its very own "crazy lady". Just watch out when they're driving!
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 8:28 PM
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i just don't equate the value of a human life with a car. sorry that people can't see the difference.
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 8:28 PM
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I did not agree with Bush's bailouts as I think "too big to fail" was a grievous assumption. You bring up some interesting points but my blog time is at an end for tonight! Everyone please enjoy the remainder of the evening!
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 8:23 PM
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they want the ins co's reformed. I tire of hearing how they are going to ration things. give me one example. thanks
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Graysongs
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11-22-09 8:22 PM
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wonderwhy - I disagree. GM is a valid example of a company to bring up in this context because they are a government-controlled enterprise at this point.
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 8:21 PM
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wvexpat- on another thread you claim factcheck is a reliable source. when i use factcheck i get booed on these threads. I always use several different sites, and do copy and paste at times, but just because i am on the opposite side of an issue, doesn't make the final analysis that you are right and I am wrong. There are many Americans that believe that the last administration took advantage of the middle class american tax payer to support their agenda. saying that I can understand your frustrations while blaming the new admin, however, it certainly doesn't have the time of 8 years to be made into such a mockery coming from the so called conservatives.
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 8:20 PM
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Former, I acknowledge and appreciate your "whimsical" nature! And Wonder, Don't take my post as going easy on you! I will challenge, question, or even agree w/ you as I see fit!
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 8:15 PM
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wvexpat= i'm from wheeling. but no biggie there. also, let's put history in action here. just 10 years ago the highest percentage fo tazes were paid by the middle class. in the past few years, middle class jobs were outsourced, and the top 1percent did gain a larger division in the space between the middle class. were enron execs due more for being cheats? of course not. bottom line, if there were more lucrative middle class jobs there wouldn't with the ability to purchase health ins, this wouldn't be an issue. bottom line the ins industry has taken advantage of the middle class. the bottom less fortunate will always need help. do I think the welfare system needs overhauled, you betcha! but, just a few months ago, people were in favor of bush telling us we were on the verge of collapse, and we had to bail out the banks. you do conveniently leave that out.
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 8:09 PM
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Yes, but the govt wants to be in the Health care biz in a much bigger way than it is already, so I thought it was relevent.
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formerohvalleyresident
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11-22-09 8:09 PM
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WVEX, well I respect your judgment on that, thanks. I was being something whimsical of course! I know a lady like Wonderwhy who drives us all insane here in the ‘hood, when you get into a discussion with her she immediately says “Your facts mean NOTHING to me, I am telling you what I feel!” Of course, you can never convince her of anything because her feelings are just that, her feelings! Libs often have their HEART in the right place. But you know what they say; a Conservative is a Liberal who got MUGGED by reality!!
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 8:07 PM
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wvexpat= gm is not in the health care biz. i also find that a sore spot. we are talking about health care here.
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 7:39 PM
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Former, I'm convinced that Wonder is sincere and not a "troll" like many of the other posters using this forum. Growing up in the general neighborhood where Wonder lives (the greater Moundsville area from what I glean from his posts), I either know him or have many friends/family who are like him. So while I generally disagree w/ him and while he occasionally p*sses me off, I still try to be civil and try to understand where he is coming from in a literal sense. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure I will bust his chops and call him out on a regular basis, but I am convinced he is legit.
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formerohvalleyresident
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11-22-09 6:54 PM
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Gray, EXPAT I cannot tell if wonderfool is a Chihuahua that types or a "plant" by the NR to get LOTS and lots of posts here :)! If “it” is a person, it sure sux to have terminal “victim-itis”
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 6:53 PM
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Wonder, You ask; "I understand some of your comments. Bottom line, if there was a solution, why wasn't it addressed b4?" My answer is in some of my earlier posts on this topic! Just look at how much money the industry has invested in our politicians (both D & R) over the years!
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 6:30 PM
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Wonder, Agreed on the CEO's making unreasonable $! So how can you explain the CEO of Govt owned G.M. (Fritz Henderson) being paid so much? Yes, the "Pay czar" lowered his base salary by 25%, but his overall compensation will increase to around $5.45 Million this year. And how about former GM CEO Rick Wagoner getting a $20 million "golden parachute" after losing $30 Billion (USA Today)? Sure, he agreed to take a "salary" of only $1, but compensation is a lot more than just salary. Is this an example of govt subsidizng corporations that you speak of so much? Or how about the execs of Fannie/Freddie receiving $210 Milliion in bonuses this year? (CBS News) How many jobs at GM or how many home loans from Fannie/Freddie could be made w/ that money? Have these people received huge sums of money by "hurting" others?
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Graysongs
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11-22-09 6:16 PM
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former - You may be correct that wonder is too stupid to know the difference between salary and other compensation like stock options. Then again, she may just as easily be intentionally lying about it "for effect". Lefties do that all the time.
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formerohvalleyresident
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11-22-09 5:44 PM
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Wonder, these guys are the top 1% of the earners who pay 40% of the tax burden of the ENTIRE USA!!! Isn’t that stunning? These guys with $20 mil taxable compensation will pay $1 MILLION on the health tax alone. You should LOVE THEM, not demonize them! They are going to pay for most of Obama’s train-wreck , budget busting, country-wrecking socialist agenda!
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 4:50 PM
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the reason i posted the 3 ceo's salaries and compensation was the latter part of the paragraphs. all seem to have gotten those while hurting others. guess people just don't see things the same way. i
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 4:27 PM
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former- If you remotely think i would be jealous of you are anyone that cheats people you are just as delusional in your mind as your posts exhibit. Your name calling, bullying, and pathetic remarks on these boards, are nothing but that. I truly wonderwhy people get some notion that people that support this President and healthcare bill don't work. unreal. I work every day, always have, and as long as my good Lord lets me, I will continue to do so.
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wonderwhy
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11-22-09 4:25 PM
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wvexpat- bummer on the Steelers. I understand some of your comments. Bottom line, if there was a solution, why wasn't it addressed b4? We need health care reform. If it takes what is going on to get it, then I support it.
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formerohvalleyresident
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11-22-09 3:56 PM
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Wondferfool, you idiot, COMPENSATION includes stock options which are not PAID by the company directly. I know you nothing about business, free enterprise, etc. but you keep confusing SALARY which IS paid by the companies directly and COMPENSATION which includes stock options which are paid mostly by Wall Street. For “grunts” like you, SALARY and COMPENSATION are the same thing. That is why you are confused and SOOOOOOO Jealous you are turning yellow! If these guys worked for Fannie Mae, their total Compensation would just be their salary because the stock is worth almost zero. If their company performs, their options are worth a huge sum. If they perform like the US Government, their options are worth ZIP ZERO NADA NOTHING. Get it?????
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WVEXPAT
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11-22-09 3:40 PM
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And keep in mind that I am responding to posts between Steeler's plays!!! LOL
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